TBOR Action President John Pudner continued on his radio tour discussing the recent federal indictment of former President Trump when he recently spoke in Champaign, Ilinois about the case and how, surprising to some, it also affects the favorability of President Biden. According to a recent piece from Nate Silver’s FiveThirtyEight, a well-regarded left-of-center pollster, approval of Biden could not only swing and flow as the case progresses during the all-important 2024 election cycle, but also how, because of many Americans seeing this as a partisan endeavor, this could make trust in the justice system ebb even further. Pudner concludes that, more than ever, prosecutors and jurors must weigh the cost/benefit analysis of this case and the implications and ramifications it could have across our Republic.
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The following transcript from this interview is presented in its entirety with minor edits:
SUMMARY KEYWORDS: Trump, Biden, Nate Silver, federal indictment, prosecutor, opponent, justice.
SPEAKERS: Stevie Jay, Diane Ducey, and TBOR Action President John Pudner.
Stevie Jay 00:00
Former President Donald Trump calling his federal indictment, "A sham election interference by the Biden administration." Trump is the current 2024 Republican front-runner. President of Take Back Our Republic Action, he also helped W. in 2000, and he is our friend, John Pudner, up in Milwaukee. John, how are you? Good. Thanks
John Pudner 00:24
Good, thanks for having me!
Stevie Jay 00:25
Good to have you on sir.
Diane Ducey 00:28
You know, somebody was asking me about the W. chapter, and that's the son, right?
Stevie Jay 00:35
That's 43. H. was 41.
Diane Ducey 00:38
And when things started to really get contentious, and we feel like the Bush era was not so much, did it all start with Trump on the contentiousness and not even negotiating?
Stevie Jay 00:53
Well, he said, and Tucker Carlson in his Twitter stuff said, it started February 2016, when Trump said they didn't have weapons of mass destruction, they knew it, and they lied. And, I think that puts the Bush and Cheney guys off of Trump. A lot of mainstream guys. Anyway, John, your take on the indictment, your take on where we are today?
John Pudner 01:14
Well, I think you have to start with the prosecutor, Jack Smith. I know that, in Illinois, it's not a shock when a governor needs to be arrested. Got some history there. Okay, thank
Stevie Jay 01:23
Okay, thank you, touche. I don't have a comeback for you, except that you're right, my goodness.
John Pudner 01:33
You're the ones who will hold them accountable, that's not a slide on you. However, Jack Smith got a couple of years sentence for a Virginia governor who was a Boy Scout, and he not only prosecuted that, went so over the top in prosecuting Bob McDonald, a guy who got money, but hadn't given them anything, not to relitigate that whole case, except to say, Jack Smith's actions were overruled 9-0 by the US Supreme Court. I mean, what it takes now to get a unanimous decision, and the quote from Stephen Breyer about his actions, so a pretty leftist Supreme Court judge, was, "To give back kind of power to a criminal prosecutor who is virtually uncontrollable, is dangerous to the separation of powers." And this is just commenting on getting a governor two years, and so this is the guy who's now appointed, so for (Attorney General) Garland to say, "Hey, I pointed this guy, who went so over the top, more than any prosecutor ever had, I got him to make sure basically it was a fair case."
Stevie Jay 02:47
And then all you hear about is that Trump appointed the judge, she has to recuse herself! I mean, my goodness. The fact...it's just unbelievable to me, John. The biggest issue for me is that equal justice under the law is a joke.
John Pudner 03:05
Yeah, and the fact that Smith led with that, that this is all about equal justice, and of course, his spin is...by that, I mean, no one's above the law. Of course, in theory, yes, of course, that we agree with that statement, but the idea that this is equal justice, and yeah, there's a saying that, "Referees don't have to call everything you see, but you need to see everything you call." if the whole focus is finding something criminal that this person did, that's not equal justice.
Stevie Jay 03:40
Wasn't it Stalin's henchmen that said, "Give me the man. I'll give you the crime." I mean, it's like this man was told did get Trump, right? That's kind of what it feels like.
John Pudner 03:54
Certainly, and it looks like malintent, and it's interesting the alarm bells being sounded, not only from the right. For example, I think I was on your show a few months ago when I said, "Hey, we all agree this makes it more likely that Trump's the nominee. The difference in opinion is does it make him a stronger or weaker general election candidate?" Well, it's interesting that Nate Silver, kind of a left-to-center publication. he's out there now discussing how much this hurts Biden politically and had a great thesis talk about how, you know, half the trust in the FBI from Republicans was during Obama's time, and they had a great line that says, "Even if Biden is able to skirt political harm as a result of Trump's federal indictment, trust in the justice system could ebb even further." So, it's interesting the new calculus, and I don't know if people on the left just thought, "Well, once this stuff starts hitting, Trump's support collapses", and you don't know, over time, these things can go different directions, but certainly so far, it seems like there's been as much of a threat to Biden.
Stevie Jay 05:01
All right, John Pudner, President of Take Back Our Republic Action, I'll tell you how you can reach him in a few moments here. I believe that, whatever is behind all of this, I just think when the time is right, all of a sudden, the media will start covering these purported tapes of Burisma, and some of the Hunter Biden...there's no way - I want to go to the window in Vegas - there's no way Joe Biden will be the Democratic nominee. What do you think of that?
John Pudner 05:31
I've been skeptical that he'd be a nominee the whole time, and partly the real concern is that some Republicans assume they have it as their opponent? I lead your way that there's a stronger opponent coming out of there.
Stevie Jay 05:43
It's gonna be Gavin Newsom, and I think he'd be formidable in this marketplace of media, the way they'll shine his hair up and make that gold, but he's very left, so I don't know.
John Pudner 05:54
I thought of a little counter for you, though. I think it could be a little closer to both of us. I think it could be Michigan's governor. I mean, as disliked as she is in Republican circles, that was a double-digit win, that was a lady who never went below positively favorable while she shut down the state. She's a politician, and she's from the Midwest, right here, where they need votes, so I do think California is so liberal, even before you talk to the person, that might be a tougher sell. I thought that was one of the beauties of the strategy of Clinton/Gore as two southern boys, they can't be that liberal? So, I think geography matters.
Stevie Jay 06:34
Well, what about JB Pritzker, Illinois?
John Pudner 06:38
Yeah, sure, it could be/ I mean, gosh, if he can buy his opponent again, like he did last time getting $20 million in the Republican primaries...
Stevie Jay 06:48
Make sure you get the opponent you want, right? Man, I don't know. I'm waiting to feel what this feels like to be a billionaire or whatever JB Pritzker is worth. Okay, how can people find John Pudner and Take Back Our Republic Action, John?
John Pudner 07:03
Yep. So the website just dropped the word fund, so it's takebackaction.org, and we've got need things like trainings for candidate volunteers who want to get paid positions, or people who want to run for office, those are the kinds of things that we've set up, so yeah, we'd love to have people sign-up and try to do something in their area and come to their community.
Stevie Jay 07:23
Takebackaction.org. Always a pleasure, sir.